No Portal Logistics and micro bases
When playing with no portals you tend to end up with a lot of small bases. If you aren't careful you will end up with either a lot of duplicated functionality , the need to move material around all the time, or both.
One example might be a farm. You will only visit it periodically just long enough to harvest and replant and as you progress, you will likely want to move it closer to your current 'front line'. However, I suggest rather than thinking farm you think 'food production facility'. I mean, why bother moving the produce elsewhere to cook?
Rather than making an empty run to the farm to harvest and haul back produce, why not haul the other ingredients to the farm, harvest and cook, then leave with a load of food?
In a similar vein, the cultivator is a required tool for farming, but do you really need a fully upgraded cultivator, and do you want to be running to a repair station when it breaks? Perhaps you arrive at your farm and realize you left your cultivator back at another base? Why not keep a cultivator at each farm and have a basic forge there to repair it?
What about defenses? Don't you need to defend the farm against raids? If you take advantage of Valheim's Rule of Three and Forty the answer is no. No because there will never be a raid there. All the defenses you need is a simple fence to keep graylings out of your crops.
Note that what I'm calling Valheim's Rule of Three and Forty might be considered a spoiler, however it is clearly stated on the official wiki. The rule is simple, except for one specific event which can occur anywhere, an event (raid) will only occur when a player is within 40 meters of three or more base structures. Base structures are also those which suppress spawns like campfire, bed, workbench, forge, etc.
I will just say that if you keep things simple enough you don't have to worry about raids. For the micro-farm, that means you only want a small shelter with a forge, a campfire, and use the "3 cooking racks and cauldron" layout so you can cook both meats and combination foods with only one campfire. Throw up a fence around the area to keep graylings and such out of your crops, beehives will help there too.
When building the farm, I'll just say follow this build order rather than spoilers. Plop down a workbench, build a shelter large enough to hold a forge, campfire, and a few chests (although those would probably be ok outside in the weather. Build the forge and any chests. Do not build a campfire yet. Put up your fence and beehives. Then destroy the workbench - you don't need it anymore.
Lastly create the campfire,and use one of the three cooking racks and a cauldron arrangements. Campfires and cooking racks don't require a workbench and a cauldron requires only a forge.
That's it for the micro farm. You can apply similar ideas to create repair micro bases that just have enough upgrades for workbench and forge to meet your equipment's minimum repair level. You can even have 'bed and breakfast' micro bases that just have a bed, campfire, and all the comfort items you can build.
Other micro bases might be things like combination mini-warehouse and cart-in-a-box repair, kiln and axes repair wood cutting center, smelter and pick repair mining base, etc.
One last note, keep your mini-bases at least approximately 100 meters apart. If you place them closer in clusters, you're better off building a regular base since you'll need defenses.
Hope this helps and I'd like to hear your ideas, and how you handle logistics in your no portal runs.
One example might be a farm. You will only visit it periodically just long enough to harvest and replant and as you progress, you will likely want to move it closer to your current 'front line'. However, I suggest rather than thinking farm you think 'food production facility'. I mean, why bother moving the produce elsewhere to cook?
Rather than making an empty run to the farm to harvest and haul back produce, why not haul the other ingredients to the farm, harvest and cook, then leave with a load of food?
In a similar vein, the cultivator is a required tool for farming, but do you really need a fully upgraded cultivator, and do you want to be running to a repair station when it breaks? Perhaps you arrive at your farm and realize you left your cultivator back at another base? Why not keep a cultivator at each farm and have a basic forge there to repair it?
What about defenses? Don't you need to defend the farm against raids? If you take advantage of Valheim's Rule of Three and Forty the answer is no. No because there will never be a raid there. All the defenses you need is a simple fence to keep graylings out of your crops.
Note that what I'm calling Valheim's Rule of Three and Forty might be considered a spoiler, however it is clearly stated on the official wiki. The rule is simple, except for one specific event which can occur anywhere, an event (raid) will only occur when a player is within 40 meters of three or more base structures. Base structures are also those which suppress spawns like campfire, bed, workbench, forge, etc.
I will just say that if you keep things simple enough you don't have to worry about raids. For the micro-farm, that means you only want a small shelter with a forge, a campfire, and use the "3 cooking racks and cauldron" layout so you can cook both meats and combination foods with only one campfire. Throw up a fence around the area to keep graylings and such out of your crops, beehives will help there too.
When building the farm, I'll just say follow this build order rather than spoilers. Plop down a workbench, build a shelter large enough to hold a forge, campfire, and a few chests (although those would probably be ok outside in the weather. Build the forge and any chests. Do not build a campfire yet. Put up your fence and beehives. Then destroy the workbench - you don't need it anymore.
Lastly create the campfire,and use one of the three cooking racks and a cauldron arrangements. Campfires and cooking racks don't require a workbench and a cauldron requires only a forge.
That's it for the micro farm. You can apply similar ideas to create repair micro bases that just have enough upgrades for workbench and forge to meet your equipment's minimum repair level. You can even have 'bed and breakfast' micro bases that just have a bed, campfire, and all the comfort items you can build.
Other micro bases might be things like combination mini-warehouse and cart-in-a-box repair, kiln and axes repair wood cutting center, smelter and pick repair mining base, etc.
One last note, keep your mini-bases at least approximately 100 meters apart. If you place them closer in clusters, you're better off building a regular base since you'll need defenses.
Hope this helps and I'd like to hear your ideas, and how you handle logistics in your no portal runs.
11:13 pm, June 7, 2022
Tyrael replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 11, 2022 @ 11:09:22 am PDT
Yeah but last time I checked it had some issues like disappearing. that would be quite the set backPretty sure there's a mod for that. Literally a build-your-own-boat mod. Would be sweet if we could just live on the boat. Build the workstations etc on it. Of course we would need a pretty massive boat to fit all the tables and additions. But having a floating house/base would be cool
8:13 pm, June 11, 2022
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Tyrael replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 10, 2022 @ 4:15:54 pm PDT
Would be sweet if we could just live on the boat. Build the workstations etc on it. Of course we would need a pretty massive boat to fit all the tables and additions. But having a floating house/base would be cool
5:13 am, June 11, 2022
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Chaoslink replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 10, 2022 @ 4:52:02 pm PDT
Pretty sure there's a mod for that. Literally a build-your-own-boat mod. Would be sweet if we could just live on the boat. Build the workstations etc on it. Of course we would need a pretty massive boat to fit all the tables and additions. But having a floating house/base would be cool
5:13 am, June 11, 2022
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blprice61 replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 10, 2022 @ 5:32:23 pm PDT
On the minimap, zoomed in the whole way, 100 meters is between 1/4 and 1/3 of the width - closer to 1/4. You could actually place base structures a bit closer - technically 81+ meters but.. no way to measure distance that exactly.
At this point, gearing up and moving into position to kill off Elder, I'm pretty much running 'no-base' Really I have a base.. sort of.. but it is just spread of a few hundred meters so it doesn't count lol.
It may sound like I'm going to a lot of trouble to avoid having a base but really the opposite is true. No raid defenses being necessary, even to the point of finding a flat area to squeeze everything into - huge time & grind savings.
Where I can't find a suitable ruins to modify, I just build on stilts - I mean I use small buildings, mostly 3x3 or a bit larger if cart garage included, others like temporary construction/rest shacks are just 2x2..
Much depends on the map. If I have long stretches of water travel without any handy islands for stop overs, it is going to mean packing up all the necessary bits & pieces to rebuild the necessary stations. Until longships this is a rather land bound strategy.
At this point, gearing up and moving into position to kill off Elder, I'm pretty much running 'no-base' Really I have a base.. sort of.. but it is just spread of a few hundred meters so it doesn't count lol.
It may sound like I'm going to a lot of trouble to avoid having a base but really the opposite is true. No raid defenses being necessary, even to the point of finding a flat area to squeeze everything into - huge time & grind savings.
Where I can't find a suitable ruins to modify, I just build on stilts - I mean I use small buildings, mostly 3x3 or a bit larger if cart garage included, others like temporary construction/rest shacks are just 2x2..
Much depends on the map. If I have long stretches of water travel without any handy islands for stop overs, it is going to mean packing up all the necessary bits & pieces to rebuild the necessary stations. Until longships this is a rather land bound strategy.
5:13 am, June 11, 2022
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Grailoch replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 10, 2022 @ 8:51:23 am PDT
After that run I can definitely say Portals ruin the "Valheim experience". Fast travel in any game can easily break immersion, and the concept of risk and reward based off distance is far more enjoyable than going from "A to D skipping B and C". It just saves time, maybe too much time.
I agree with this statement. Portals ruin immersion and make the game end too fast.
I just traveled back to my second black forest base from my third i have started near a swamp. I will likely stay here a while and collect some finewood and bronze to finalize the workbenches I have at the third base.
My next base move (to the elder altar area) will likely be my last move before the endgame base. That island has the trader, elder altar, and all 5 biomes of decent size available on it.
If I did not have to do the housework of setting up new bases and areas of operation, if I could just plop a portal back to my first base down, I would just be plowing through the content again a third time. Without the timesinks of building sustaining infrastructure the game is pretty fast.
5:13 pm, June 10, 2022
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Lucidess replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 10, 2022 @ 7:07:31 am PDT
You should see the run I made with no portals, long roads with tons of 2x2x2 houses with firepit and any finewood furniture I can cram inside.
Your mini-bases should be separated based off your Stamina bar so you can run inside, get the resting/comfort bonus right away, then run back out.
After that run I can definitely say Portals ruin the "Valheim experience". Fast travel in any game can easily break immersion, and the concept of risk and reward based off distance is far more enjoyable than going from "A to D skipping B and C". It just saves time, maybe too much time.
Your mini-bases should be separated based off your Stamina bar so you can run inside, get the resting/comfort bonus right away, then run back out.
After that run I can definitely say Portals ruin the "Valheim experience". Fast travel in any game can easily break immersion, and the concept of risk and reward based off distance is far more enjoyable than going from "A to D skipping B and C". It just saves time, maybe too much time.
2:13 pm, June 10, 2022
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blprice61 replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 8, 2022 @ 1:15:14 pm PDT
Or you could just not farm. Makes it a lot easier and less bollocksing around in my opinion. Done a no portal, no farm, no static base run and worked beautifully, boat with carts was my caravan and I only cooked stuff that I found, no toiling in the fields for me
Sounds like 'no farming' is a hard mode option all by itself. I've been playing limited lives (permadeath or +1 life per boss kill) and the idea of voluntarily giving up HP and stam to avoid the farming aspect literally never occurred to me.
I'll have to investigate further, thanks :)
11:13 pm, June 8, 2022
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blprice61 replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 8, 2022 @ 1:37:34 pm PDT
I’d probably just rush a longship s fast as I could and set up a cart-filled ship with all my stuff on it. You can fit quite a few carts on a longship rather comfortably and anything you set up is entirely temporary.
It sounds like both you and Fzanco are using a 'wandering caravan based'* mobile main base strategy. Doesn't that make for increased travel time to the 'front' and/or more danger when setting up? I guess I'm used to thinking a single base as being safely placed in a meadows somewhere.
I see the longship as a major part of the transport infrastructure but on some maps access to some points of interest via water routes can be very limited. Perhaps I'm just getting more than my share of bad maps?
When you have your longship loaded up with carts on the deck, what happens in major storms? Do you manage to avoid 'cart overboard'?
* [seems I'm not politically correct enough and unaware that the name that used to be used for wandering caravans is now a forbidden word]
11:13 pm, June 8, 2022
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Fzanco replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 8, 2022 @ 1:59:53 pm PDT
I have lost a cart in storms, but after that I found the best way to store carts is at the rudder end, I pointed them into the stern and they were pretty rock solid after that I can't remember if ended up with 3or 2 carts in that configuration.
I would find an already made hut, tower, cave entrance etc. Troll cave was the best in free shelter set up, you can fit everything in the troll entrance all sheltered. When I was done exploring that island and using the resources I'd pack up and move on just like a "wandering caravan person" . Wow can't believe the g word is censored lol
I would find an already made hut, tower, cave entrance etc. Troll cave was the best in free shelter set up, you can fit everything in the troll entrance all sheltered. When I was done exploring that island and using the resources I'd pack up and move on just like a "wandering caravan person" . Wow can't believe the g word is censored lol
11:13 pm, June 8, 2022
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Chaoslink replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 8, 2022 @ 2:51:58 pm PDT
I don't typically lose them. I think its in part because they're always heavy so they're reluctant to move and partially because I angle the ship to ride with the waves. Though I also tend to avoid deep waters in storms.I’d probably just rush a longship s fast as I could and set up a cart-filled ship with all my stuff on it. You can fit quite a few carts on a longship rather comfortably and anything you set up is entirely temporary.
It sounds like both you and Fzanco are using a 'wandering caravan based'* mobile main base strategy. Doesn't that make for increased travel time to the 'front' and/or more danger when setting up? I guess I'm used to thinking a single base as being safely placed in a meadows somewhere.
I see the longship as a major part of the transport infrastructure but on some maps access to some points of interest via water routes can be very limited. Perhaps I'm just getting more than my share of bad maps?
When you have your longship loaded up with carts on the deck, what happens in major storms? Do you manage to avoid 'cart overboard'?
* [seems I'm not politically correct enough and unaware that the name that used to be used for wandering caravans is now a forbidden word]
As for being too far from certain things, I don't have much issue there. Set up the small temporary shelter for rested and repairs, then just go out to wherever and return to your ship when done. The amount of things you keep when traveling like this is always low, so you don't usually have a few hundred ingots or whatever on you. You mine what you need, then process and use it pretty much immediately.
Only time I lose carts is if I capsize the ship entirely and that is usually only an issue on rough seas collecting turtle barnacles. Though I've learned to keep the materials for a Karve on hand and just plop that down if I need to go somewhere like that. I don't always use the longship for everything.
11:13 pm, June 8, 2022
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Chaoslink replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 8, 2022 @ 8:14:43 am PDT
I’d probably just rush a longship s fast as I could and set up a cart-filled ship with all my stuff on it. You can fit quite a few carts on a longship rather comfortably and anything you set up is entirely temporary.
5:13 pm, June 8, 2022
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Fzanco replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 8, 2022 @ 5:13:57 am PDT
Or you could just not farm. Makes it a lot easier and less bollocksing around in my opinion. Done a no portal, no farm, no static base run and worked beautifully, boat with carts was my caravan and I only cooked stuff that I found, no toiling in the fields for me
2:13 pm, June 8, 2022
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Grailoch replied to No Portal Logistics and micro bases June 7, 2022 @ 3:20:05 pm PDT
Nice. I don't have much to say on the topic yet. I have only done one base move so far. I left all the workstations at it and just loaded a cart with all my spare materials. I had enough spares to get a new full scale base up and going.
Soon (tomorrow?) I will be moving to a swamp some distance from my base. I am fairly sure I will be there long enough to exhaust the food and mead supplies I take with me. So, how will I deal with it? Not sure yet. But maybe in a couple play sessions I'll be able to chime back in with an answer.
Soon (tomorrow?) I will be moving to a swamp some distance from my base. I am fairly sure I will be there long enough to exhaust the food and mead supplies I take with me. So, how will I deal with it? Not sure yet. But maybe in a couple play sessions I'll be able to chime back in with an answer.
11:13 pm, June 7, 2022
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