Originally posted by Polonius Ulf:

So they are hiring people to trash indie games in general and, because of its success, Valheim in particular.

A touch of cynic realism is not always a bad thing, but I'd like to draw the line between it and foil-hat conspiracy theories... even if it does sound like what megacorps would like to do, if they just got away with it. For now, it probably looks better on them if they just continue rigging the system that already favors them by means of manipulating review aggregate scores, media coverage and things like that. Actively pushing others down on grass-roots level would be much nastier.

I don't really see what this has to do with biomes and development of Valheim though. Even if Coffee Stain's parent company (you didn't forget Valheim is not an indie game, did you?) holds the likes of what used to be THQ Nordic, Deep Silver, Gearbox and others, I'd like to think Valheim being successful enough on its own feet to not have its development influenced by outside factors.

ocean is gonna be a smaller one kinda like heart and home as i doubt itll get dungeons and the like as too many seeds have already generated alot of thier ocean biome by now as you simply cannot avoid it in most seeds to begin with.

but theyll maybe add some more sea creatures to fight in there sooner or later.
maybe even some sort of boss aka raidevent on ocean "the kraken is beeing released"

a bigger boat is also on the way probaly either with ashlands or shortly afterwards. its about time we get some boat progression again i mean the dvegr even have giant piers for boats. and doing that with deep north is simply too late. not much point in a new boat when you are already at the last biome anyway.

what i am wondering about is this :

its called DEEP NORTH. would it even make sense to spread this biome out on the map with world generation? seems a bit unlikely given the name of it. unless they rename it of course.

meanwhile ashlands is clearly undead themed again like the swamp so spirit damage will be useful once more.
some weapon classes are likely beeing left out by ashlands just like in other biomes. not sure which ones but guessing but what we got and what they showed in concept i assume these weaponclasses might get left out for ashlands (deep north HAS to have weapons for all classes as its the last biome and thus leaveing weaponclasses out at endgame would be a bit unfair) :

bow. didnt get one with plains. got one now. might not get one in ashlands and then deep north has the final one.

2 hand hammer. skipped 2 biomes before. if it skips again itll be now.

a new axe for chopping is not very likely with ashlands given the biomes nature. OR its reversed and deep north wont have one but that would a bit unlikely given its the end.

pretty sure magic wont see much upgrades in ashlands as its currently stronger than melee in alot of aspects already so it takeing a break would simply bring it in line with melee again. maybe a new lighting staff tough. but i doubt fire and ice staffs will see new versions already now given thier power. new food is very likely of course,

if the pickaxe doesnt get another upgrade itll be now. and then final one with deep north. otherwise there will be a new pickaxe in ashlands. this depends on what they do with flamemetal ore when the update hits. hard to predict therefore.

buckler will take a break. tower shield is 100% comeing.

polearms will take a break with ashlands. its thier last chance for a break.

a new mace is 100% comeing.

Originally posted by Vyktor:

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

Who hurt you in childhood?

I have a healthy cynicism born of 40 years of computer gaming industry experience and you wrongly assume people stop hurting you when you stop being a child.

That level of cynicism is only fostered in early childhood though. And Videogames have only been heavily monetized for like the last 10 years, "DLC" wasn't even a concept until the Xbox360. So my question stands as valid both unanswered and as an assertion.

Read the early access box on store page:

Approximately how long will this game be in Early Access?

“We don’t know. We’re currently working on our seventh biome, the Ashlands, and after that we have one more to complete (the Deep North) before we’ll consider the game to be version 1.0. It’s a pretty safe bet to say that Valheim will be in active development for at least another two years (counting from January 2023). Aside from the large biome updates, we also want to add smaller updates to fill out the game.”

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

Originally posted by Vyktor:

I have a healthy cynicism born of 40 years of computer gaming industry experience and you wrongly assume people stop hurting you when you stop being a child.

That level of cynicism is only fostered in early childhood though. And Videogames have only been heavily monetized for like the last 10 years, "DLC" wasn't even a concept until the Xbox360. So my question stands as valid both unanswered and as an assertion.

I can out-cynic anyone. Don't get me started!

Too late

Saying nothing about present company, I think some of those who always take the straightest possible line from "There's something about this $20 unfinished game I don't like" to "The devs must be a gang of crooks!" are paid.

In fact, I sincerely and with best wishes hope that most of them are, because the alternative is that they are really unhappy and no one is even paying them.

Now, hold my beer, and I'll show you some cynicism: Big publishers have a revenue problem. AAA titles cost hundreds of millions just to develop, and then there's the advertising.

Meanwhile, players can afford to spend only so much on games every year. So if Big Gaming raises the price for a costly title, that won't increase the total revenue from players. If I blow my budget on one title, I'm done spending.

Which means they need other sources of revenue besides players. Cutting to the chase, they are under pressure to spy on us and sell our data.

I think indie games and the early-access, crowd-funded development model, with its ability to support rapid evolutionary development by a small team plus real gamers is a threat to the dump huge cash into one project ala Hollywood movies model.

So they are hiring people to trash indie games in general and, because of its success, Valheim in particular.

I'll take my beer back, now. You drank it? I'm not cynical enough, after all. ;)

Hello people :)
Back to topic please.

Whenever the last biome is finished, the game will not be. There is the meta-game: options, scoring, Some big finale. And there is final polish: I'm hoping for passes that will add details to each biome.

Originally posted by Vyktor:

I reckon they'll have snorted and punted enough of their profits on horses and charlie, and charlie horses by the time Deep North is done that they'll make the Ocean (and anything after) a paid DLC or some other greed manoeuvre. Time will tell though...

Who hurt you in childhood?

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

Who hurt you in childhood?

I have a healthy cynicism born of 40 years of computer gaming industry experience and you wrongly assume people stop hurting you when you stop being a child.

I reckon they'll have snorted and punted enough of their profits on horses and charlie, and charlie horses by the time Deep North is done that they'll make the Ocean (and anything after) a paid DLC or some other greed manoeuvre. Time will tell though...

Ashlands is upcoming, then after that it's Deep North.

Their original plans featured an ocean expansion but that may come after the Deep North. Oceans might be a big project but it's not really in the chronological progression scheme as far as I can tell.

My theory is since the Ocean is omnipresent at any point in the game there will be different levels of reward available to you there. Just like how fighting sea serpents on a raft or karve is a bad idea, but you can later take one down with a proper bow or longboat.
Meanwhile as soon as you have a pickaxe you can gather barnacles from Leviathans.

I think it will be different activities that benefit you at various stages, so it will likely be the last thing on the list of "biomes"

I think.. oceans might be a smaller update?

I mean everything is there the framework I mean.. what would they need to do to it? maybe add a few more enemies? special storms? other resources like the chitin floating rock or give them a greater purpose?

Definitely think deep north will be the "last" biome. then lets hope they open up steam mods.. could you imagine the possibilities? the mods they have now are already so good.

I believe they will leave the ocean biome for the end. You can access it at any point of the game and I think it will require some kind of scaling in difficulty depending on your game progression. That is why I think they will leave it for the end, so they already have all the parameters they need to develop it.

Depends on if they count the Ocean biome as a true biome or not in their count. If they don't count the Ocean (I personally wouldn't... considering it has no real content) there is one more Biome after the Far North.

But just because I wouldn't count the Ocean as its own Biome, doesn't mean they don't, it is technically a Biome, with one(1) unique mob.

The only other Biome I can think of would be the World Tree itself, Yggradasil There's no room on the map for anything else.

Originally posted by The early worm deserves the bird:

So, looking at the Valheim road map and looking at a few random world seeds it looks like Mistlands is the penultimate biome as all the Mistlands seem to be on the boarder of the maps around the edges of the far north and south. I know they are working on Ashlands after this and then my guess would be the north after that as that would give you the incentive and game play loop to explore the entire world.

So then my question is this: Do you think the north will be the last biome or do you think there will be others?

there is also frost biom on the edge