Blunt vs Blade

The title may seem provocative, but I'm not looking for heated opinions on which you like best, but more suggestions from either side on what I might be missing in my comparison.

Background

When I got to Black Forest the first time in Valheim, I first made a sword, which just seemed obvious to me. Then I found atgeir and fell in love. Not long after that I tried the sword secondary ability, saw the huge numbers, and have been a sword guy ever since.

Lately I've been trying different weapon and armor combinations, and really love a light-armor, knife/dagger build. I ran that all the way through Mistlands, and it's awesome! The one fault that I found is the inability to hit multiple targets.

That showed up fairly early when I was in the mountains in troll armor and an abyssal razor. It would tear through single wolves like nothing, but I died to a pair of wolves. One went down quickly, but the other one got a good hit in and staggered me, which didn't end well. There were a few more time, like multiple seekers that could have been easily handled with a sword, turned into a tough fight with Skoll and Hati, which are awesome otherwise.

I also tried a run with atgeir as my main (and only). It is very good overall, but I found it awkward in tight spaces and I had a hard time aiming the primary attack, so I gave up on it. I still carry it most times as a secondary for AOE damage.

I finally decided I had to try clubs to see if I've been wrong all along preferring swords, and if there really was something that made clubs/blunt fundamentally better.

I do really like Frostner. It's a pretty unique weapon. It seems like mistwalker trumps it in all ways. Of course it should, given that it's two biomes later, but I don't know what blunt weapon at that level matches mistwalker. I'm still quit a ways from that, though, so I'll reserve judgement.

TL;DR, start here:

Currently I'm fairly early swamp with a bronze mace, bronze bucker, and troll armor. All level 3 I believe. I mostly use a flint axe and bow (for troll) in black forest (I pretty much skip meadows), but I did use the torch a fair amount, so my skill is not zero, maybe 20?

First observations in swamp:

  1. Skeletons are noticeable easier to kill with the mace, but they are just pests at this leve.
  2. Blobs seem easier, but I have never had any issues with blobs with any weapon.
  3. Fighting a single draugr seems pretty similar to what it's like with a sword. I haven't tried a 2* or elite yet, but a 1* went down easy enough.
  4. The secondary attack against draugr seems pretty good. Probably not as good as a sword, but good enough at this point. I almost 1-shot a 1* with a parry + secondary.
  5. Troll are atrocious. I didn't even know they were resistant to blunt until I took one on. It works eventually, but takes forever. At this stage I'm used to taking down trolls with no problem.
  6. I haven't even taken down an abomination yet (although I did let a troll do that for me), and I don't dare.
  7. There is a stone tower with a body pile next to the crypt that I'm currently working. I don't like those, due to the difficulty getting to the body pile, but it's usually not too bad with a sword. I tried it with the mace and had to retreat. Every swing would hit at least one side of the doorway, and two draugr, which means it was doing very little damage.
  8. I was surprised by a daytime wraith when I first entered the swamp (why's it getting light all of a sudden?!?), and had no problem with the mace.

I'm trying to be open minded, but so far I have to give the upper hand to bronze sword in early swamp. Is there anything I'm missing, or that I might be taking the "sword" approach to and putting the mace at a disadvantage?

I should add that I know you can take out troll and abomination with bow, and I know all the other methods. I find bow boring, though, and I'm trying to compare melee weapons, so please don't suggest that.

I'm probably going to head to the mountains soon. I don't generally build many iron items. I haven't found the trader yet, so Frostner and iron sledge are not an option, but I don't think it's fair to evaluate clubs without including those, so I'll find the trader one way or another.

I'm not really concerned about a single wolf with a bronze mace, but I am a bit concerned about more than one, so I'll have to be careful. On the other hand, stone golem should be easier if I decide to take one on.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Zep Tepi replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 5:47:25 pm PDT

I used to pick up mace as quickly as possible, but quickly found it a bit tedious. Sword is faster and doesn't eat as much stamina. (Although I mainly use atgier now up until silver sword and mistwalker. I like not having things touch me at all. And it's my "poor man's parry.") At this point I only make a mace for bonemass. Of course stagbreaker's usefulness in crypts is only topped by other ground pounders.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Fzanco replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 6:05:25 pm PDT

I keep the 2h mace as my secondary for panic situations now. One hand mace is good but the trade off for a dagger that has less stam use, quicker, lighter, easier to stun lock I think it can't compete unless you need it for weakness damage for bonemass. Really depends on playstyle. I agree with you that bows trivialize and make it boring if you weigh your entire gameplay on them
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Bored Peon replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 6:23:44 pm PDT

Maces are pretty universal for swamp, except abominations. Which then you just use your axe for something other than chopping trees.

For mountains iron mace is best as it will usually stun wolves on the first swing and kill the second. Swapping to the Frostner in mountains is a horrible idea because the golems take less damage from it than an iron mace. Although a Porcupine later does work well.

Frostner does work fairly well in plains because it slows the fulings down on first hit, then it is easy to flank them for the other hits.

As for multiple wolves giving you a hard time,most of their power comes form fast staggering attacks, which even in fully upgraded wolf armor you get staggered frequently if hit .
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Faceplant8 replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 6:57:33 pm PDT

Originally posted by Bored Peon:
For mountains iron mace is best as it will usually stun wolves on the first swing and kill the second. Swapping to the Frostner in mountains is a horrible idea because the golems take less damage from it than an iron mace. Although a Porcupine later does work well.

Are you suggesting that iron mace is better than Frostner? I assume so, since that sounds like the same effect I see with sword (bronze or iron). It staggers on first hit and finished on second (if it didn't finish on first).

Originally posted by Bored Peon:
As for multiple wolves giving you a hard time,most of their power comes form fast staggering attacks, which even in fully upgraded wolf armor you get staggered frequently if hit .

Yes. I understand that, but a sword will easily stagger multiple wolves, it makes that much less likely. A dagger will take out one wolf easily, but others are nipping at you while you do it.

That said, I think it would be tough to get staggered by wolves in fully upgraded wolf armor. I tested that in another thread with iron armor, and the wolf doesn't do enough damage (to HP I think) to stagger unless you're very low on (maximum) health. L3 troll armor is a different story, though.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Faceplant8 replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 7:00:07 pm PDT

FWIW, a bronze mace will kill a sea serpent. I don't know how that compares to sword, since I don't get the opportunity often, but the mace worked acceptably.

I also found a troll to help "open up" the stone tower that I had problems with, which made it much easier to breach.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Bored Peon replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 7:08:45 pm PDT

Originally posted by Faceplant8:
Originally posted by Bored Peon:
For mountains iron mace is best as it will usually stun wolves on the first swing and kill the second. Swapping to the Frostner in mountains is a horrible idea because the golems take less damage from it than an iron mace. Although a Porcupine later does work well.

Are you suggesting that iron mace is better than Frostner? I assume so, since that sounds like the same effect I see with sword (bronze or iron). It staggers on first hit and finished on second (if it didn't finish on first).
Yes because golems are immune to the the frost and spirit. Which makes the Frostener inferior to iron mace.

https://valheim.fandom.com/wiki/Stone_Golem
Immune (0x) Fire, Frost, Poison, Spirit

Iron mace 55/73 blunt
Frostner 35/35 blunt
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Bored Peon replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 7:25:02 pm PDT

Originally posted by Faceplant8:
That said, I think it would be tough to get staggered by wolves in fully upgraded wolf armor. I tested that in another thread with iron armor, and the wolf doesn't do enough damage (to HP I think) to stagger unless you're very low on (maximum) health. L3 troll armor is a different story, though.
Since xp earned blocking is atrocious I make it a habit of blocking/parrying a mob before killing it. If I miss the timing and the wolf hits a twice in a row that is when the stagger happens. Also as you pointed out the total health makes a BIG difference, which depending how far your buffs have decayed will influence it.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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knighttemplar1960 replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 7:27:13 pm PDT

For a new start I go with club which is a mace class weapon and my stone axe deals with things that are weak to slash or resistant to blunt. When I get sufficient copper and tin I make a bronze mace which gets me every thing but trolls because the vast majority of what I'm dealing with is weak or neutral to blunt damage until I get past the mountains. Trolls are weak to pierce but fire arrows work better than flint on trolls. The next weapon is a bronze atgeir for swarm control (and for trolls).

When I get enough iron in the swamp I make an iron mace and then an Iron atgeir because both of those are useful all the way to the plains. Mace for the golems and single wolf, iron atgeir for wolves plural, fire arrows for the drakes.

When I head to the plains I make a silver sword with the iron atgeir for crowd control and the bow for deathsquitos. When I get enough black metal I make a black metal sword and then a black metal atgeir.

I'm visually impaired and my motor control isn't good enough for knife use and exploring with a knife is a bit slow since it works best when you sneak which can be time consuming and I'm not quite patient enough for that.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Apple replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 8:24:11 pm PDT

Only used a mace for bonemass. Havent used it anywhere else
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Faceplant8 replied to Blunt vs Blade May 14, 2023 @ 9:05:42 pm PDT

Originally posted by Apple:
Only used a mace for bonemass. Havent used it anywhere else

I've fought bonemass (and all the bosses with exception of the queen) with a knife. It's just a matter of how long it takes.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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WhiteDwarf replied to Blunt vs Blade May 15, 2023 @ 1:38:44 am PDT

Im only using an axe, i know it could be the weakest but i do like those slow paced animations, that 3 strike combo.. sword is to fast, it feels like a klick spam, i know it is not but still.. I also do like atgeir play stile...or in my case two handed spear with a mod that im using.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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MF replied to Blunt vs Blade May 15, 2023 @ 7:07:07 am PDT

Nice tip regarding iron mace vs golems. I never thought of that.... I tend to kill the wolves with either silver sword or frostner, and run from the damn golems lol.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Faceplant8 replied to Blunt vs Blade May 15, 2023 @ 7:35:52 am PDT

I also think that iron mace is the best weapon against stone golem, but, like bonemass, they're so slow that you can kill them with anything. It's just a question of how long it takes.

I also tried killing an abomination with an axe, with very mixed success. The problem was that I couldn't hit it.

With a sword, I kill the abomination by parrying it and then jabbing it with the secondary attract. It doesn't take long, and it's relatively easy if you can get the parry timing. Miss that too many times, and you're swamp goo, but if you hit it, the follow up with the sword pretty much always hits.

I tried to use the same tactic with the bronze axe, and I think I landed with the axe once or twice. It seemed like the slow attack speed of the axe was throwing off the timing just enough so that, after a parry, the time it took to move back into position from the knockback and swing the axe meant the abomination was already raising for the next attack. The swing just whiffed underneath him.

I had to drag another troll over to help me finish him off. They are really the most helpful mobs, Always lending a hand when you need it.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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Bored Peon replied to Blunt vs Blade May 15, 2023 @ 7:47:01 am PDT

Originally posted by Faceplant8:
With a sword, I kill the abomination by parrying it and then jabbing it with the secondary attract.
Iron axe takes about 12 hits.
Black metal axe takes like five.

Originally posted by Faceplant8:
I also tried killing an abomination with an axe, with very mixed success. The problem was that I couldn't hit it.
The big trick to the abomination is watching the two front legs.
If it is attacking with the right leg then attacking the right leg is difficult.
If you stand in the right spot the right leg misses and the left leg is wide open.
Also if you can hit the main body it does far more damage.

Sometimes just hide behind your shield and wait for the opportunity makes a difference.
2:13 pm, May 17, 2023
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