Originally posted by Faceplant8:

If you're rested and just swinging a weapon, you should not have any issues with stamina. Also, max stamina has very little effect on regen rate, so what food you eat is mostly irrelevant.

If you're near 0 stamina, base regen rate is 12/sec. Rested bonus makes it 24. I think the max stamina required for a sword is 16, and the 3-swing attack takes a bit under 3 seconds, so a bit less than 1 sec / swing, so you regen faster than you use it, not even counting skill bonus.

Not entirely true because stamina regen isn't constant. If people are spamming attacks and not allowing stamina to start its regen before swinging again, then their stamina regen is effectively zero, even while rested. That's why this is a button mashing problem and not a regen rate problem. Chopping wood, mining, fighting, it's all so much better once you realize you can't hold down the attack button or click like crazy. It's a timing thing.

Originally posted by Danson:

Originally posted by Faceplant8:

If you're rested and just swinging a weapon, you should not have any issues with stamina. Also, max stamina has very little effect on regen rate, so what food you eat is mostly irrelevant.

If you're near 0 stamina, base regen rate is 12/sec. Rested bonus makes it 24. I think the max stamina required for a sword is 16, and the 3-swing attack takes a bit under 3 seconds, so a bit less than 1 sec / swing, so you regen faster than you use it, not even counting skill bonus.

Not entirely true because stamina regen isn't constant. If people are spamming attacks and not allowing stamina to start its regen before swinging again, then their stamina regen is effectively zero, even while rested. That's why this is a button mashing problem and not a regen rate problem. Chopping wood, mining, fighting, it's all so much better once you realize you can't hold down the attack button or click like crazy. It's a timing thing.

That's a good point. I forgot there is a delay between using stamina and when the regen starts. I probably have that programmed into my fighting style and don't even realize it.

Originally posted by Faceplant8:

-snip-
Of course, moving, jumping, dodging, blocking all add to that, but how often do you just swing your weapon constantly? The closest I come to that is the wolf event, where I pretty much stand around and swing my sword, but, even then, it's just a couple swings to kill the current group, and then wait a few seconds for the next.

Oh Oh, i thought of another time it's super easy to just end up spam swinging, "Skeleton Surprise" raid event. As much as i normally either kite with a bow or enjoy my parries with melee this event is entirely skeletons (and rancid remains if you are lucky) and happens at about that time you are already going crazy with blunt in the swamp. There is something weirdly satisfying about just going *step, smack, pop, step, smack, pop* that entire raid.

I appreciate everyone recapping their experience with the last time they played vs now. To everyone on this "button mashing" topic, I appreciate you trying to help but as I said, I'm end game gear and food. I understand the stamina system and that the combat is "souls-like" in regard to stamina management and button mashing. This is not the issue or the topic of this thread.

This goes beyond the norms of stamina management and feels like they either messed up and have no idea what they are doing (more likely) or as someone else said they are coping with their garbage AI combat by punishing the player with ridiculous stamina cost, and low stamina regen.

Again, before you keyboard warriors jump to my rescue, I understand food, and potions, I know there are options, I am using those options. It just feels off. I never had to put this much thought into food, it also seems like the max health got a nerf too. I remember cap at around 175-190 fully fed (end game food) now it seems to cap at 160. All the enemies feel considerably weaker now so it doesn't matter, there is a lot more room for error.

Even tho the combat was garbage when this released, the enemies did so much damage it provided enough challenge for me. Deathsquitos would one shot, Orcs 2 shot, and stamina was less of an issue. Now stamina just feels like a slog-fest and the enemy isn't challenging at all.

Anyway thanks for confirming I wasn't misremembering things.

You are right and i feel the same, thats why i got a mod that reversed the stamina system.

The food/strength/stamina system just makes you pay attention to what you eat and how you fight.

During a fight, you have to pay attention to stamina, creating time and space to take breathers. Making the other guy do the hard work was a vital skill for melee warriors irl. A lot of people died because they were too fatigued to defend themselves. Our protag even has a dream about dying that way.

After a while, managing stamina becomes part of your planning and tactics. Getting good at something is part of the fun of a game. Acquiring competence feels good.* "What is happiness, but the feeling that resistance is overcome…"

*(Edit) Thrift, thrift, Polonius "Getting good feels good."

Originally posted by ᛟᛗᚾᛁᛉᛁᛞ:

You are right and i feel the same, thats why i got a mod that reversed the stamina system.

What mod are you using?

Originally posted by Polonius Ulf:

The food/strength/stamina system just makes you pay attention to what you eat and how you fight.

During a fight, you have to pay attention to stamina, creating time and space to take breathers.

You don't even need to take actual breathers. If you're rested and you pause for quite literally a fraction of a second between swings instead of button mashing, your stamina can be practically unlimited. The game punishes button mashing and failing to maintain a rested buff, but some people are convinced it's an unavoidable and inherent part of fighting or harvesting. I would be shocked if the vast majority of people who hate the stamina system aren't either mashing the attack button or holding it down, and I think if they recorded their gameplay they'd be surprised at how often they don't have a rested buff.

Originally posted by Vinegaroon:

Originally posted by ᛟᛗᚾᛁᛉᛁᛞ:

You are right and i feel the same, thats why i got a mod that reversed the stamina system.

What mod are you using?

Im using the HearthandHomeOldFoodStats it also lets you setup how you want your regenerationrate and stuff like that.

Also know, that each new weapon has a higher stamina cost than the previous tier and while damage scales, the food clearly doesn't. 1 tier higher food of 2 food and 1 stamina is what, 14 extra stamina?, compared to the previous that means after 7 swings it feels off and this keeps going up and up. This is the reason i still use Frostner, i barely notice a difference compared to that mistwalker sword while it uses far less stamina.

The constant stamina cost increase needs to go away, it limits the combat so much. Just imagine 2 biomes later, 1h weapons will cost 20 stamina while we have a fraction of the stamina more, so we can hit a few times and we need to wait again. I tried that 2h sword which already is 20, i hit a few times and i need to walk around, can barely kill two freakin' draugr's before i need to regen again.

Seriously, why would an iron sword cost more stamina than a bronze sword. Last time i checked bronze was heavier than iron. Just have weapons types cost the same amount of stamina, make enemies more challenging so you need to dodge more so you need to use more stamina for that. Combat just becomes more and more tedious the further you get while no actual difference in combat happens

Its not *that* bad, but its a little rough if you are running and jumping around a lot. If you want to do the mario approach, try the new weapons that don't use stamina?
Going toe-to-toe with block & hit, I don't have a lot of trouble, but I can't quite do that against the soldiers or starred guys in ML.

Originally posted by John:

Also know, that each new weapon has a higher stamina cost than the previous tier and while damage scales, the food clearly doesn't. 1 tier higher food of 2 food and 1 stamina is what, 14 extra stamina?, compared to the previous that means after 7 swings it feels off and this keeps going up and up. This is the reason i still use Frostner, i barely notice a difference compared to that mistwalker sword while it uses far less stamina.

The constant stamina cost increase needs to go away, it limits the combat so much. Just imagine 2 biomes later, 1h weapons will cost 20 stamina while we have a fraction of the stamina more, so we can hit a few times and we need to wait again. I tried that 2h sword which already is 20, i hit a few times and i need to walk around, can barely kill two freakin' draugr's before i need to regen again.

Seriously, why would an iron sword cost more stamina than a bronze sword. Last time i checked bronze was heavier than iron. Just have weapons types cost the same amount of stamina, make enemies more challenging so you need to dodge more so you need to use more stamina for that. Combat just becomes more and more tedious the further you get while no actual difference in combat happens

If you're rested and just swinging a weapon, you should not have any issues with stamina. Also, max stamina has very little effect on regen rate, so what food you eat is mostly irrelevant.

If you're near 0 stamina, base regen rate is 12/sec. Rested bonus makes it 24. I think the max stamina required for a sword is 16, and the 3-swing attack takes a bit under 3 seconds, so a bit less than 1 sec / swing, so you regen faster than you use it, not even counting skill bonus.

Of course, moving, jumping, dodging, blocking all add to that, but how often do you just swing your weapon constantly? The closest I come to that is the wolf event, where I pretty much stand around and swing my sword, but, even then, it's just a couple swings to kill the current group, and then wait a few seconds for the next.

Yea it's pretty bad. I think they're not really great at making enemies or AI or combat mechanics so they use player restrictions to make it more difficult.

They are right, it would be too easy if you scale it back, but that's not our fault, they shouldn't punish the player because they don't know how to make the game actually challenging and skillful.

Large supposedly scary enemies just fly into rocks and roots and get stuck and sometimes just walk into them and can't figure out how to get around it. They all have super easy to predict attacks and whatever parrying is silly easy it's all a joke.

It's really unbalanced and honestly don't see how they can fix it without going back to the drawing board.

In order to scale back stam usage they need to actually add skilled challenge like harder enemies that actually know how to fight. Which I haven't seen anything like anywhere in this game. The only thing that knows how to fight in this game is a Growth. Well done on that one. The rest all suck.

So if you ever why you feel so restricted just go fight some enemies and pay attention to how bad they are at fighting. They had to do something I guess... but is making us all 80 years old the answer? I guess we did die, so maybe we are old af and just can't breathe anymore lol.

I am recently coming back after a while myself. I last played a bit before caves came out so both caves and mistlands are new to me. I started a new map since my last save had areas where i already found that cobwebbed trees "this is supposed to be mistlands but it doesnt exist yet" placeholder terrain. So far Im only in bronze age dipping my toes into iron (if i could find more than one crypt i might say im actually iron age) on this new world and already i'm noticing what seems to be subtle but sweeping changes and I genuinely can't tell if i am misremembering either or if those vaguely mentioned "rebalancing updates" made overall changes. Some things seem to spawn a lot more than i recall (leviathans and black forests mostly in my current seed, and i have trouble believing abominations are "rare" spawns when i can find 4 in one trip in the same tiny swamp that only had one crypt...not that i'm complaining there, their armor is quite nice), some things seem to spawn a lot less (havent bumped into a serpent yet, and seen only 2 oozers this whole swamp expedition, and I went on a 6 continent quest for a meadow large enough to actually get bees finally, but hey i found my trader over it so win!) but i also dont know if maybe i just got a weird seed to since i chose a random one.

Stamina does seem mildly more annoying but i honestly figured that might be because my last character already had maxed sprint/jump skills so maybe i just felt sluggish by comparison basically. That hasn't seemed too bad for me at least, or at least not as bad of an adjustment as when they rebalanced the food and health/stamina systems overall.

Comfort has felt like i'm getting slightly less than i should be as well, and that the yule tree i currently have just compensates, but that's another where im not sure if i just have memories of a time i was spoiling myself late game or if that changed to.

They revamped the entire food system, and provided many more food options to "adjust" your stamina pool, If you are going to do things that are going to require more stamina.

It's still very much a stamina-management game, so if you are one to mash the run button and jump around, you are going to be in deep trouble when the enemies inevitably show up.

Rested bonus is still the same, except for recently fixing the unintended "stacked rested bonus" (for multiple rugs). It's still the same exact bonus as it always was, and the number of comfort items still only determines the length of time the bonus lasts, before needing to be re-applied.