Originally posted by FissionChips:

Or even just build a double wall, or put out spikes, and/or put some of the wolves outside the wall to murderate everything...

I tried stone walls. I tried spikes. The wolves ate through it all and let themselves out. :P

What is up with all the threads lately that basically boil down to "I want <feature> but without any of the negative aspects clearly implemented as a balance element"

Like, ya'll just want Valheim to be a no-consequences toy, don't you?

I want my wolf to have 5000 HP

I want my lox to do no collateral damage

I want mistlands without the terrain or mobs

I want equipment without the durability

I want portals without the ore restrictions

I want sea serpents without the rarity

I want Magic, but available immediately

I want all food to have Eitr

I want Skeletes to be stronger than 2 star Seekers

I want

I want

I want

I want a toilet made out of solid gold, that fires molten platinum from it's bidet.

I mean, the list of this can go on seemingly in perpetuity. What it seems you want, is another game. Like Minecraft creative mode.

I'm obviously being hyperbolic, but I just really don't think people consider knock-on effects. like you make lox or wolf the perfect base defense with no downsides, that like... that renders an entire game mechanic (Raids) pointless. The lox itself can already thrash any raid including "They Sought You Out" and the only thing that even remotely balances it is that it can just as easily be the cause of most of the destruction, lmao.

Originally posted by Jarska:

The destruction caused by tame animals does not seem like a planned game mechanism.

I'd argue that instead the destruction caused by tame animals seems like a player planning failure.

Also double walls only increase repairing if something gets through the first wall.

I just don't put them near an outer wall. It may not be practical in all cases, but it can help if you put them out of agro range of anywhere mobs can span and/or get to.

That said, in my main world I just put a few of each type into a sort of Noah's Ark building after the bat update came out. Bats and playing no-portal killed my interest in keeping animals.

Originally posted by FissionChips:

Originally posted by Jarska:

The destruction caused by tame animals does not seem like a planned game mechanism.

I'd argue that instead the destruction caused by tame animals seems like a player planning failure.

Also double walls only increase repairing if something gets through the first wall.

It is 100% planned. As someone pointed out, you can friendly fire your own base with your own weapons.

All of Valheim's core mechanics are a cost-benefit analysis. Everything from Building, to the food system combat itself.

But somehow, some people are fooling themselves into thinking the tamed animal system is the one exception to this other wise 100% consistent rule, lmao.

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

What is up with all the threads lately that basically boil down to "I want <feature> but without any of the negative aspects clearly implemented as a balance element"

Like, ya'll just want Valheim to be a no-consequences toy, don't you?

I want my wolf to have 5000 HP

I want my lox to do no collateral damage

I want mistlands without the terrain or mobs

I want equipment without the durability

I want portals without the ore restrictions

I want sea serpents without the rarity

I want Magic, but available immediately

I want all food to have Eitr

I want Skeletes to be stronger than 2 star Seekers

I want

I want

I want

I want a toilet made out of solid gold, that fires molten platinum from it's bidet.

I mean, the list of this can go on seemingly in perpetuity. What it seems you want, is another game. Like Minecraft creative mode.

I'm obviously being hyperbolic, but I just really don't think people consider knock-on effects. like you make lox or wolf the perfect base defense with no downsides, that like... that renders an entire game mechanic (Raids) pointless. The lox itself can already thrash any raid including "They Sought You Out" and the only thing that even remotely balances it is that it can just as easily be the cause of most of the destruction, lmao.

It's an early access game, so of course people share their opinions and what they want. Some are bad ideas and some are complete crap, but sometimes good ones can emerge. I only raised a problem that can of course be fixed in other ways.

I think it's fine if Lox can wreak havoc by stomping enemies if they get inside the structure. I just think it's a bad thing that wolves and loxes help raid mobs get into the base by destroying walls that the enemies wouldn't necessarily destroy themselves.

Originally posted by Jarska:

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

What is up with all the threads lately that basically boil down to "I want <feature> but without any of the negative aspects clearly implemented as a balance element"

Like, ya'll just want Valheim to be a no-consequences toy, don't you?

I want my wolf to have 5000 HP

I want my lox to do no collateral damage

I want mistlands without the terrain or mobs

I want equipment without the durability

I want portals without the ore restrictions

I want sea serpents without the rarity

I want Magic, but available immediately

I want all food to have Eitr

I want Skeletes to be stronger than 2 star Seekers

I want

I want

I want

I want a toilet made out of solid gold, that fires molten platinum from it's bidet.

I mean, the list of this can go on seemingly in perpetuity. What it seems you want, is another game. Like Minecraft creative mode.

I'm obviously being hyperbolic, but I just really don't think people consider knock-on effects. like you make lox or wolf the perfect base defense with no downsides, that like... that renders an entire game mechanic (Raids) pointless. The lox itself can already thrash any raid including "They Sought You Out" and the only thing that even remotely balances it is that it can just as easily be the cause of most of the destruction, lmao.

It's an early access game, so of course people share their opinions and what they want. Some are bad ideas and some are complete crap, but sometimes good ones can emerge. I only raised a problem that can of course be fixed in other ways.

I think it's fine if Lox can wreak havoc by stomping enemies if they get inside the structure. I just think it's a bad thing that wolves and loxes help raid mobs get into the base by destroying walls that the enemies wouldn't necessarily destroy themselves.

It is a bad thing, it's designed to be a bad thing, it's a designed that way so there is a risk associated with keeping wild animals in your base. Just like everything else in Valheim is a cost/benefit risk/reward analysis. If you need proof, just look at the Ballista and the developer commentary surrounding that.

Maybe they'll change it, maybe they should change it, but it is 100% consistent with the rest of the entire game as it functions now.

It's why I keep my Lox in either an open paddock/roaming or down in a pit, same with wolves....they fill the trenches of my bases and I keep the above ground inside stone structures that keep most of the damage at bay. I do keep 2 no-star doggos inside my first Meadows base, next to the main trophy alter and they good doggos, they just roam around the portal and don't seem to cause any damage...

Someone has never worked on a farm before......

There is a reason farmers have to repair barns and fences on a regular basis. A 2,200 pound "tame" Brahma bull can destroy a brick or cinder block building in moments. Tame =/= harmless.

Originally posted by Kjeldgaard:

dig a moat around your base problem solved :P

I don't particularly care for ugly trenches. I wrote this a bit in the hope that it could be useful in the development of the game. In the game, it is possible to build several different walls to keep the enemies out, so it doesn't make sense that the biggest threat to structures is your own pets.

Originally posted by FissionChips:

Or even just build a double wall, or put out spikes, and/or put some of the wolves outside the wall to murderate everything...

a double wall means twice as much to repair. Spikes are a good idea and rarely come into use anyway. However, Lox causes destruction just by rampaging around when an enemy is nearby. The destruction caused by tame animals does not seem like a planned game mechanism.

It does make sense because you can damage your own structures, too. Structures are exempt from the normal PvP restrictions(a tame lox can't kill a tame wolf or you accidentally, for example). Perhaps a ward like functionality could be used here, but that creates complications for multiplayer. If I prank a friend and lock him up, he should be able to break free after all.

Never had a wolf damage or lox climb over my earthen wall. I placed a 2m trench at the base on the side where invasions most often approach. I now have packs of 2 star wolves surrounding my base, (no longer any lox nearby) and I can stand back and watch them wipe out invaders. I try to race and engage if the event is "A Foul Smell From the Swamp" as that is about the only one that can decimate 2 star wolves. 99.9% of the time invaders never get near my walls, because I know the trick is to drop everything and rush out to meet them. Wolf packs outside the walls are deadly and self sustaining. They continually grow in numbers as they kill deer and boar. My base is in a patch of meadow surrounded by Black Forest, built over one of those berry patch villages.

Originally posted by dirktoot:

It does make sense because you can damage your own structures, too. Structures are exempt from the normal PvP restrictions(a tame lox can't kill a tame wolf or you accidentally, for example). Perhaps a ward like functionality could be used here, but that creates complications for multiplayer. If I prank a friend and lock him up, he should be able to break free after all.

Another solution would of course be to fix the reaction distance so that they don't attack if there is a wall between the animal and the enemy. In Lox's case, a little destruction from rampage is still tolerable, but when they form that cheerleading pyramid and break the ceiling, something is wrong.

dig a moat around your base problem solved :P

Or even just build a double wall, or put out spikes, and/or put some of the wolves outside the wall to murderate everything...